Home Page Lo-Fi Wireframes v2

Matt Harris unicorn.consulting at gmail.com
Tue Mar 19 12:19:14 UTC 2019

On 19-Mar-19 10:09 PM, neandr wrote:
> Some comments about Matt's notes ... see inline ..
> Günter
> Am 19.03.19 um 11:54 schrieb Matt Harris:
>> <...>
>> I would still like to see add-ons removed from the top menu and 
>> replaced with a general info block pointing the use to the add-on 
>> manager, which I am seeing as another page link lower in the wire frame.
>> Can we also get away from the grey on grey and black on grey which 
>> are so difficult to read.  They look pretty,  but unless your monitor 
>> and graphic is really u to snuff they are not a good choice to 
>> actually read.
> Addons are an essential part of the TB offering and the user should 
> have a short path to get to. So the [Add-Ons] button at the first line 
> is OK.

Yes they are integral,  we also want to have your users downloading and 
installing from within the add-on manager.  This is not Firefox, going 
to ATN in a browser is not the short way to install a working valid for 
your version of Thunderbird add-on.  So would it be ok of ATN simply 
removed the download buttons for addons when viewed in a browser? I 
would not like to go that far.  But I am tired of the regular post of I 
downloaded the XPI file but I double click it and nothing happens, or it 
refuses to install.  Until we fix the ATN site and the add-on manager I 
think we are honour bound to NOT make it more complicated for the 
average user.  an Add-ons menu item does that.  You clearly disagree,  
so we will have to agree to disagree and others can make the decision 
for us based on our comments to this subject.  Perhaps we need more 
localization to the operating system so double clicking an XPI file does 
do something on Windows.  But I am talking about what is best for the 
web site.  I have no control over what developers think is important 
with Thunderbird.
>> We need to finally remove the lightning download from the web site.  
>> Some Linux maintainers do not bundle it,  but that is not our 
>> problem.  WE do bundle it for all operating systems.  For Linux users 
>> that have issues with their distributions copies should be addressing 
>> their issues to the maintainers,  not having Thunderbird take the 
>> retrograde step to go back in time to when their maintainers are 
>> living.  Sorry Linux folks,  but that is one of the reasons Linux is 
>> still niche.  Maintainers and other individuals is positions of power 
>> make appalling decisions and everyone just works around them.  The 
>> download link needs to be removed and we should be encouraging folk 
>> to click yes on the first run install. Instead of catering to a small 
>> group of loud minority product users by offering a totally useless 
>> download link  that will start an install process in the hardest 
>> possible way that is to install a product that more than 90% of users 
>> get with their install.   Many users just have that install pane on 
>> the bottom of the windows basically for ever,  they often appear in 
>> screen shots in support topics.  They really have no idea what it is 
>> and ignore it as it does not prevent mail activities.
>> Given the explosion of support request for folk already on the beta 
>> channel about their "functions" that have been removed by uncaring 
>> developers,  I think it is probably going to be a long haul until the 
>> add-on environment supports the top 20 or 30% of add-ons.  WE need to 
>> warn folk that those cuttong edges do in fact have blood on them and 
>> it is not always plain sailing.  If it was it would be a release version.
> Also I don't fully understand your concerns here, what is the problem 
> to inform the vistor of the page to get some hints about Lightning?
> Leave the section.
Give all the hints you like.  Just don't offer a download link that is 
useful for less that 10% of site visitors.  Confusing and counter 
productive for the other 90+%.  If your distribution is not building and 
packaging Lightning with their repo,  that is something that your 
distribution must fix.  But modifying the web site because your 
maintainer is not living in the same world as the rest of us and failing 
to deliver functional software as intended is not really an option.  For 
instance Lightning is available in the ubuntu repository,  more 
convenient for most users that get software from that repository. But 
that is not an issue for Thunderbird.  it is an issue for the relevant 
>> I also think that if we have a prominent option for a page Language 
>> that will actually change the locale,  then the other discussion 
>> about systems and languages becomes moot.  Change the display 
>> language to Macedonian and you get a Macedonian download offered.  
>> From my scrolling up and down and left and right,  it look to be 
>> currently way to the bottom and out of view on page load.  It needs 
>> to be up the top where it can be found as soon as the page loads in 
>> the wrong language.  A good place might be the space left by the 
>> add-ons link in the menu.
>> This is as I understand is something of an issue for a lot of British 
>> expats in Spain.  They want British English Thunderbird but get 
>> Spanish, so there are multiple use cases where another language might 
>> be required.
> A real good point.
> Selection for the page and for the download should separated. That is 
> choosing the page language (manually or because of the OS or so) 
> should not hard set the downloaded language version.

I think the download button should offer the language of the page and 
only that as well as the operating system from the browser string.  
Inconvenience is one of the side effects of munging browser strings. 
Convenience is one of the benefits of leaving it honest. Clicking 
download should most certainly not open pandora's box of languages and 
operating systems.  There is an X in the corner of the page that will be 
the common response to that.

The base web site really must be designed for a poorly trained monkey if 
it is to be successful.  With the language skills of a 8-10 years old 
child.  This is not being derogatory,  it was in my training 30 years 
ago for writing government copy, and correspondence.  Other languages as 
Wayne suggested should be in the "other languages" page.  But instead of 
a little "link" under the download button to the other languages page 
make it one of those blocks like are used for lightning...  "want to see 
what other community languages Thunderbird is available in.  Want to 
download it for another operating system and perhaps a bit of a we need 
help in localisation.


“Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain.” /― Friedrich 
von Schiller, Die Jungfrau von Orleans /
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