Rebranding Tunderbird to Firefox Mail

Ryan Sipes ryan at thunderbird.net
Fri Apr 5 22:39:15 UTC 2019


Eyal,

> Ryan, I have to protest you rejecting messages about this suggestion
> which are contrary to your opinion, while allowing yourself to present
> your own opinion. This inappropriate for you as the list moderator.
I rejected it because Thunderbird has no control over Firefox's branding
or strategy. So I didn't want to have a contentious discussion about
whether we should rebrand to "Firefox Mail" - as it is not remotely a
possibility. I think that should be clear from the fact that MoCo
jettisoned us a few years ago.

As for responding with my own opinion. I was addressing the only part of
the conversation that was possible to take action on, talking about the
future development of Thunderbird.

I'm sorry you feel that I abused my power. But I hope my explanation
gives you some clarity into why I acted in the way that I did in regards
to moderation.

Ryan Sipes
Community and Business Development Manager
Thunderbird <https://thunderbird.net>

On 4/5/19 3:47 PM, Eyal Rozenberg wrote:
> Ryan, I have to protest you rejecting messages about this suggestion
> which are contrary to your opinion, while allowing yourself to present
> your own opinion. This inappropriate for you as the list moderator.
>
> Eyal
>
>
> On 05/04/2019 20:40, Ryan Sipes wrote:
>> Well, I let this one through on accident. But I'll explain why I won't
>> be letting the others through.
>>
>> I think the idea is a neat one and I agree that Firefox has great brand
>> recognition compared the Thunderbird (and even Mozilla). But, this
>> simply isn't possible given our current relationship to Firefox's
>> driver, the Mozilla Corporation (MoCo).
>>
>> Perhaps that will change in the future, and we're having some
>> conversations about our relationship to all parts of Mozilla - but what
>> you are describing would require full buy-in from MoCo and, at present,
>> I don't see that happening.
>>
>> We are headed towards a Thunderbird that could be run in a browser (or
>> at least that is one vision for the future that Magnus talked about in
>> his run for Council). As we get closer to that we could approach MoCo
>> and the Firefox team and see where we can work together.
>>
>> But, I think time is better spent thinking about how we can leverage the
>> Thunderbird brand to do really cool stuff that people want to use.
>>
>> Ryan Sipes
>> Community and Business Development Manager
>> Thunderbird <https://thunderbird.net>
>>
>> On 4/5/19 8:03 AM, Amir Farsi wrote:
>>> Eyal, youy said "Firefox Mail suggests a focus on web-based mail
>>> access, which is
>>> the opposite of what Thunderbird offer"
>>> I wanted to say it's not opposite with what Thunderbird offer as well
>>> as Opera Mail isn't opposite with What Opera Mail offers.
>>> In addition, IMO Firefox Mail shouldn't be only an email client, it
>>> can be have a web based versioin too! Yes, a Cloud independent mail
>>> client web app. Users shold be able goto https://mail.firefox.com and
>>> connect it to their email accounts on mail servers via POP3 and... and
>>> cloud servers will do required works instead of desktop/mobile.
>>> In addition, users should be able to install Web based Firefox Mail on
>>> their own servers. It will not a email service it should be a cloud
>>> email client only. However it can be a secure email service too as
>>> well as Firefox Send is a Secure Cloud Storage Service.
>>> Amir.
>>>
>>> ‫‪Eyal Rozenberg‬‏ <‪eyalroz at technion.ac.il
>>> <mailto:eyalroz at technion.ac.il>‬‏> در تاریخ جمعه ۵ آوریل ۲۰۱۹ ساعت
>>> ۱۸:۰۹ نوشت:‬
>>>
>>>     Ok, since you're actually seriously arguing for this:
>>>
>>>     1. Thunderbird is a mail client, not a browser. It is not a browser
>>>     attachment, nor a browser modification. "Firefox Mail" suggests the
>>>     opposite.
>>>     2. "Firefox mail" suggests a focus on web-based mail access, which is
>>>     the opposite of what Thunderbird offers.
>>>     3. It would sound as though the developers are ashamed of their own
>>>     software - so much so that they had to hide the name.
>>>     4. I am against ever talking to "brand strategists". Also, no
>>>     astrologers and no psychics.
>>>     5. Thunderbird's relation to Firefox is gradually weakening, not
>>>     getting
>>>     stronger - no sense in pretending as though the opposite is happening.
>>>     6. Thunderbird's current predicament is not the result of a poor
>>>     choice
>>>     of name. The name is fine.
>>>
>>>     Eyal
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>     On 05/04/2019 15:57, Amir Farsi wrote:
>>>     >   * No. It's a *Brand and marketing solutions to save the most
>>>     popular
>>>     >     open source email software*, not April  Fool's joke.
>>>     >
>>>     > I know currently, Thunderbird is a Mozilla Foundation incubated
>>>     project,
>>>     > not Mozilla Corporation's product. But as you know, *Mozilla
>>>     Messaging*
>>>     > (abbreviated *MoMo*) was a wholly owned, for-profit subsidiary
>>>     of the
>>>     > non-profit Mozilla Foundation and Thunderbird was their product.
>>>     But as
>>>     > result of reducing Thunderbird market share, MoMo merged with
>>>     Mozilla
>>>     > Corporation and periority of Thunderbird reduced for MoCo and
>>>     even MoFo.
>>>     > But i think popularity of Firefox brand can help to Thunderbird
>>>     to make
>>>     > it popular again.
>>>     > *I think if tb-council talk with a Branding Strategist, they will
>>>     > recommend rebranding to Firerfox Mail*.
>>>     > Recently, mozilla corporation using Firefox brand for all of it's
>>>     > products. And their new branding techhnique was suceessful. Firefox
>>>     > Lockbox isn't a Web Browser but it's using Firefox brand to be
>>>     sucessful.
>>>     > I want to request you(tb-council) to *talk with MoFo andf MoCo
>>>     board of
>>>     > directors and Mitchell Baker* and suggest them to use Firefox
>>>     Mail brand
>>>     > instead vof Thunderbird to make it great again. I'm sure they
>>>     will agree
>>>     > ith you and me.
>>>     > Amir.
>>>     > Best wishes for you and Thunderbird 
>>>     >
>>>     >
>>>     >
>>>     >
>>>     >       
>>>     >
>>>     > ‫‪Eyal Rozenberg‬‏ <‪eyalroz at technion.ac.il
>>>     <mailto:eyalroz at technion.ac.il>
>>>     > <mailto:eyalroz at technion.ac.il
>>>     <mailto:eyalroz at technion.ac.il>>‬‏> در تاریخ جمعه ۵ آوریل ۲۰۱۹
>>>     ساعت ۱۳:۲۳
>>>     > نوشت:‬
>>>     >
>>>     >     If you m eant this as an April Fool's joke - you're three
>>>     days late.
>>>     >
>>>     >     On 04/04/2019 18:49, Amir Farsi wrote:
>>>     >     > Hello dear Thunder Mozillians!
>>>     >     > As you know, People knows Firefox more than Mozilla.
>>>     >     > For example, when i say to my friends i'm contributting to
>>>     >     Mozilla, they
>>>     >     > say what is mozilla?
>>>     >     > When i say i'm contributting to Firefox, then they will
>>>     know it
>>>     >     Very Fast.
>>>     >     > I want suggest redbrand Thunderbird to *Firefox Mail* in
>>>     countinue of
>>>     >     > Firefox Products Family.
>>>     >     > I think redisign and redranding Thunderbird together will
>>>     increase
>>>     >     > chance of success of Mozilla's New Generation of Mail
>>>     Products.
>>>     >     > After Firefox Quantom, and Firefox VR and,... now new
>>>     generation of
>>>     >     > Firefox Mail can make a bomb like next generation of
>>>     Firefox(I mean
>>>     >     > Firefox Quatom).
>>>     >     > You can see Opera branded their email client as *Opera
>>>     Mail* not other
>>>     >     > thing.
>>>     >     > Please compare how many People know what is Opera Mail and
>>>     How many
>>>     >     > pople know about Thundrbird.
>>>     >     > I think one of important factoras in  currrent status of
>>>     >     Thunderbird, is
>>>     >     > bad Branding. However Mozilla refused use of other names
>>>     for other
>>>     >     > products even new password manager, Firefox Lockbox.
>>>     >     > Please share your opinion about it...
>>>     >     > Best.
>>>     >     > Amir
>>>     >     > https://mozillians.org/en-US/u/amir.farsi/
>>>     >     >
>>>     >     >
>>>     >     > _______________________________________________
>>>     >     > tb-planning mailing list
>>>     >     > tb-planning at mozilla.org <mailto:tb-planning at mozilla.org>
>>>     <mailto:tb-planning at mozilla.org <mailto:tb-planning at mozilla.org>>
>>>     >     > https://mail.mozilla.org/listinfo/tb-planning
>>>     >     >
>>>     >
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> tb-planning mailing list
>>> tb-planning at mozilla.org
>>> https://mail.mozilla.org/listinfo/tb-planning
>> _______________________________________________
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>> https://mail.mozilla.org/listinfo/tb-planning
>>
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