[rust-dev] Deprecating rustpkg

Tim Chevalier catamorphism at gmail.com
Tue Jan 28 13:29:48 PST 2014


rustpkg is definitely unfinished. It's not clear to me that what it
needs is to be destroyed, rather than finished. That is, there may
well be good reasons; I just haven't seen them so far in this thread.
The concrete points that a few people have made are ones to do with
unfinished pieces of rustpkg that are relatively well-delineated from
the entire system.

I'm not trying to argue for keeping it, it just seems to me that for
the good of the project, the reasons why it couldn't be salvaged
should be documented somewhere. As the person who did most of the
work, but wasn't able to finish it because I left Mozilla, it's
surprising to me that the fact that rustpkg isn't finished is being
used as a reason to purge it entirely. Rust is, after all, not
finished yet -- as a whole -- but we're not throwing out the entire
language.

Cheers,
Tim


On Tue, Jan 28, 2014 at 11:28 AM, Ian Daniher <explodingmind at gmail.com> wrote:
> Lots of good points in this thread, but I wanted to request deprecation, but
> not removal until a better alternative is documented and made available.
> Rustpkg works for my needs - I use it every day -  but it definitely needs
> some TLC.
>
> Thanks!
> --
> Ian
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 28, 2014 at 11:46 AM, SiegeLord <slabode at aim.com> wrote:
>>
>> On 01/27/2014 11:53 PM, Jeremy Ong wrote:
>>>
>>> I'm somewhat new to the Rust dev scene. Would anybody care to summarize
>>> roughly what the deficiencies are in the existing system in the interest
>>> of forward progress? It may help seed the discussion for the next effort
>>> as well.
>>
>>
>> I can only speak for myself, but here are some reasons why I abandoned
>> rustpkg and switched to CMake.
>>
>> Firstly, and overarchingly, it was the attitude of the project development
>> with respect to issues. As a comparison, let me consider Rust the language.
>> It is a pain to make my code pass the borrow check sometimes, the lifetimes
>> are perhaps the most frustrating aspect of Rust. I put up with them however,
>> because they solve a gigantic problem and are the keystone of Rust's
>> safety-without-GC story. rustpkg also has many incredibly frustrating
>> aspects, but they are there (in my opinion) arbitrarily and not as a
>> solution to any real problem. When I hit them, I do not get the same sense
>> of purposeful sacrifice I get with Rust's difficult points. Let me outline
>> the specific issues I personally hit (I know of other ones, but I haven't
>> encountered them personally).
>>
>> Conflation of package id and source. That fact combined with the fact that
>> to depend on some external package you have to write "extern mod = pkgid"
>> meant that you needed to create bizarre directory structures to depend on
>> locally developed packages (e.g. you'd have to put your locally developed
>> project in a directory tree like so: github.com/SiegeLord/Project). This is
>> not something I was going to do.
>>
>> The package dependencies are written in the source file, which makes it
>> onerous to switch between versions/forks. A simple package script would have
>> solved it, but it wasn't present by design.
>>
>> My repositories have multiple crates, and rustpkg is woefully
>> under-equipped to handle that case. You cannot build them without dealing
>> with pkg.rs, and using them from other projects seemed impossible too (the
>> extern mod syntax wasn't equipped to handle multiple crates per package).
>> This is particularly vexing when you have multiple example programs
>> alongside your library. I was not going to split my repository up just
>> because rustpkg wasn't designed to handle that case.
>>
>> All of those points would be solved by having an explicit package
>> description file/script which was THE overarching design non-goal of
>> rustpkg. After that was made clear to me, I just ditched it and went to C++
>> style package "management" and a CMake build system.
>>
>> -SL
>>
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>
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-- 
Tim Chevalier * http://catamorphism.org/ * Often in error, never in doubt
"If you are silent about your pain, they'll kill you and say you enjoyed it."
-- Zora Neale Hurston


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