<div dir="ltr"><div><div><div>Mozilla's (like any other organization's) resources are limited, so they need to prioritize the things they work on.<br></div>Bad
UX is not the only criteria for prioritizing an issue. Of course it's
bad UX, though it only justifies to be given a high priority in case it
affects a high number of users. E.g. if those 'unwanted' <video>
elements are just used by 5% of websites on the whole internet and only
10% of them are well-visited websites and half of all Firefox users have
an ad blocker installed, then the amount of users actually facing this
issue is 3 of 1000. (These numbers are just made up. They could be much
higher or much lower. It's just to give an understanding of what Gijs is
asking for.)<br><br></div>Having said this, I agree that this
should be improved. Though it doesn't affect me personally as I am
having an ad blocker installed and therefore never see such videos.<br><br></div>Sebastian<br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 11 February 2015 at 19:48, Russ Thomas <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:russgthomas@gmail.com" target="_blank">russgthomas@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">Forgot to hit Replay All.. :/<div><div class="gmail_quote"><span class=""><br><br><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed Feb 11 2015 at 11:15:52 AM Gijs Kruitbosch <<a href="mailto:gijskruitbosch@gmail.com" target="_blank">gijskruitbosch@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<div>On 05/02/2015 14:14,
<a href="mailto:teoteoteoteo@virgilio.it" target="_blank">teoteoteoteo@virgilio.it</a> wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">Considering the <span><span><a href="mailto:gijskruitbosch+bugs@gmail.com" title=":Gijs Kruitbosch
<gijskruitbosch+bugs@gmail.com>" target="_blank"><span>Gijs
Kruitbosch</span></a></span></span><span><span>
suggestion given in this post:<br>
<br>
<a href="https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1124176" target="_blank">https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/<u></u>show_bug.cgi?id=1124176</a><br>
<br>
I'm writing to you to explain why the task '</span></span><span><span>Add an item in config:about to
stop autoplay of videos inserted by <video> tag' should
be priorer than other Mozillian activities (I know it is not
absolutely right, but I think that a problem feeled since 3
years ago should be priorer than others)!<br>
<br>
1. First of all we can say that almost all sites are starting
to insert HTML5 advertisement videos in their pages that start
as soon as the page is opened.<br>
</span></span></blockquote></div><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
"Almost all sites" is clearly an overstatement. But this in
particular is something where data would be really useful. How many
sites (not in your personal experience, but compared with something
like the Alexa top N sites, etc.) do this? Do they use the autoplay
attribute, and/or how many use JS instead and trigger .play()
themselves ? Can we get data from advertising networks on how many
of these types of video ads they run and what the trends there are?</div></blockquote><div><br></div></div></div></span><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>Forgive me Gijs, but that would not help answer the question "Are we doing the right thing?" </div><div>When applied to Firefox and this issue, I'd say Firefox is failing - or at the very least, missing an as yet undefined UX requirement. All the statistics that are possible to obtain via any means available, will not address or support "right or wrong" in this regard, and if you believe they do/may, then you're asking the wrong question.</div><div><br></div><div>This is a UX problem. Period.</div></div></div><span class=""><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><br>
<blockquote type="cite"><span><span>Considering that we usually
open more than 1 tab at a time the performances of firefox
could decrease drammatically</span></span></blockquote></div><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
We shouldn't spend CPU/GPU cycles rendering video in the background
(even while rendering audio, which is usually muted by default for
these ad things inasmuch as I've seen them). If we do, we should fix
that instead. Doesn't matter if it autoplays or not.</div><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><span style="font-size:13.1999998092651px"></span></div></blockquote><div><br></div></div></div></span><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>Again, this has no bearing on the nature of this issue. Fast, slow, huge amounts of memory or none, it's a bad UX which is experienced through an individual's perception. </div></div></div><span class=""><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><span style="font-size:13.1999998092651px"> </span><br></div></blockquote><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<blockquote type="cite"><span><span>2. The problem is present
since 3 years ago ... so I think it could be better to fix it
before other tasks<br>
</span></span></blockquote></div><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
There are tens (if not hundreds) of thousands of bugs filed which
are older than 3 years. A bug's age simply isn't correlated to how
important it is in the way you suggest.</div></blockquote><div><br></div></div></div></span><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>Then let me suggest this: it's age and the fact that it hasn't "died" is related to a remaining, unfixed, poorly addressed, bad UX in Firefox. Whether or not that pushes it "up" the priority scale is not a matter for us users. It's a matter for those that are tasked with ridding Firefox of all perceived bad UXs. If it is believed this is not a bad UX, then that position needs to be pronounced and defended by its supporters. I don't see *any* such supporters (although I see a lot of tangential waffling - present company excepted, of course ;) )</div></div></div><span class=""><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><br>
<blockquote type="cite"><span><span>3. This is a problem that only
non-</span></span>technicians have, because technicians
usually have an Ad-block that usually stops every ad-video. Thus,
considering that non-technicians don't know that there is
bugzilla, you should consider to fix it as soon as possible even
if there are not a lot of votes<br>
</blockquote></div><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
This applies to everything in bugzilla ("there are many people who
are affected by this who won't be filing bugs or voting for them")
and doesn't in and of itself really indicate an issue's priority,
because the size of the non-bugzilla population is pure speculation
from bug to bug.</div><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><br></div></blockquote></div></div></span><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>More statistical supposition which may or not be supported by adequate research. It doesn't matter. Calling out to a larger body of evidence with a broad brush sweep of all of bugzilla does not address "yes, but are we doing the right thing here?" It's a bad UX. Period.</div></div></div><span class=""><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<blockquote type="cite">4. Even though I think the suggestion given by Gijs
(write the request from a data-driven point of view) is
meaningless,</blockquote></div></blockquote></div></div></span><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>Perhaps I wouldn't use the word "meaningless" here but yes, I agree with the sentiment. It's unhelpful and misses the point.</div></div></div><span class=""><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
In fact, you're proceeding to give an implementation-focused
response. By data-driven, I meant, something based on data about how
many users this affects, and how serious a problem it is. See my
response to (1).</div></blockquote><div><br></div></div></div></span><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>Let me try another way - a browser (or any technology, for that matter) is not built solely by consensus, democratic "weight" of support or any other statistical measurement (if it was, it could never get off the whiteboard).</div><div><br></div><div>Of course there are times when the math, the evidence and the weight of numbers is the right path to take to aid a decision. But this is not one of them. It's bad UX. UX is about perception (and, as individuals, perception is all we have).</div><div><br></div><div><snip proposed implementation detail></div></div></div><span class=""><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><br></div><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
Unfortunately, you've not given much of a justification as to why
this is important in the general sense. </div></blockquote><div><br></div></div></div></span><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>He, along with others on the bugzilla bug have given more than adequate reasons (and reasoning) as to why this is important to them - and not just in the general sense. What everyone is saying is, they hate the UX at this code point in Firefox. If that's not clear now, I don't know how else to explain it to you.</div></div></div><span class=""><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">That doesn't mean it isn't
important, but we do need a better idea of how widespread it is, </div></blockquote><div><br></div></div></div></span><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>I disagree (for reasons mentioned earlier).</div></div></div><span class=""><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">and
how widespread the annoyance with it is, backed up in some objective
way, rather than "I am personally really annoyed by this".</div><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><br></div></blockquote></div></div></span><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>Sometimes, that's the only way to address really annoying UXs.</div><div><br></div><div>Sum up: I've been a developer for 30+ years. I work to many mantras but one of the longest standing mantras I try to adhere to is "software should not conspire to trap the user". Right now, in this regard, Firefox is trapping the user and placing their experience in the hands of an unknown 3rd (or even 4th) party not of their choosing.</div><div><br></div><div>That, sir, is BAD UX.</div></div></div><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div><div> Russ</div></div></div><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<br>
~ Gijs<br>
</div>
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