<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=us-ascii"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">Sorry for the late response, but I wholeheartedly agree with the below. It wasn't Plan A, but makes a fine Plan B. If we ask localizers to become engaged only once a version of Firefox is on m-a for a couple of cycles, and don't use overlapping string names for pre-/post-Australis, we'll be covered.<div><br></div><div>I don't see any other major risk to quality or schedule caused by backing out Australis on merge day, and had discussed with Dolske prior to this message going out. Even if the backout has a couple of hiccups (which shouldn't happen given careful planning), we still have a whole week to iron out any issues.<div><br></div><div>-Alex</div><div><br><div><div>On Jul 4, 2013, at 10:38 AM, Johnathan Nightingale <<a href="mailto:johnath@mozilla.com">johnath@mozilla.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><div>On Jul 4, 2013, at 12:46 PM, Axel Hecht wrote:</div><blockquote type="cite">On 7/3/13 11:04 PM, Justin Dolske wrote:<br><blockquote type="cite">On 7/3/13 1:20 PM, Axel Hecht wrote:<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">This is a major misconception on what string freeze is.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">String freeze is not per channel, but per release. Firefox 25 string<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">freezes, and then migrates to aurora.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Major l10n-impact landings as part of migration are not OK.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">I don't think there's any shared understanding of that at all. It's<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">certainly news to me. You're effectively asking people to not change<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">strings on m-c more than once a cycle, and that's never been a policy.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">If localizers are working off m-c, they should be doing so that things<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">can and will change throughout the cycle. It's no different than add-on<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">authors tracking API changes.<br></blockquote><br>This is not what I said. I do think that our code should be good to ship, though, or landed behind flags.<br><br>Your proposal to crash land a backout on merge day is concerning to me, as is your lack of engagement to mitigate that risk.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>"Crash land" is usually polemic language we use when we want to make someone seem irrational. How about if he "carefully, with weeks of pre-notice, intends to back out at a predictable time at the end of the 25 cycle," instead? I confess that I am also confused on the concern, here. As far as I can tell, the order of events in a month's time will be:</div><div><br></div><div>a) Rel-Mgmt announces merge-day festivities beginning</div><div>b) FF25 migrates to m-aurora</div><div>c) seconds later, m-aurora experiences an "Australis is not ready for primetime" backout (m-c is not similarly backed out)</div><div>d) Rel-mgmt announces merge-day festivities end</div><div>e) FF25 is string frozen, and on Aurora</div><div><br></div><div>Keeping the old strings around during the 25 cycle, per flod's suggestion, sounds like it will make life easier for localizers who track m-c (and bless them!) so I'm happy that there's agreement on doing that piece. What's the remainder of the concern?</div><div><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">l10n aside, I think this is one of those landings that would carry less<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">risk if it was just addition of code, and the old code was behind a<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">channel-specific flag.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">This simply isn't practical for the scale and scope of Australis' changes.</blockquote><br>Yikes. I said it. Yikes. Not for l10n, but for the product.<br></blockquote><br></div>I'm afraid I don't understand this part, either?<div><br></div><div>J</div><div><br><div>
<span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; border-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; border-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; border-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; border-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div>---</div><div>Johnathan Nightingale</div><div>VP Firefox Engineering</div><div>@johnath</div></div></span></div></span></div></span></span>
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